ThiN-kha-e e lang kong2 thiN-kha-e e taichi.

2008-06-13

ThiN-kha-e e lang kong2 thiN-kha-e e taichi.

From: gugarn.giatou
Date: 2008-06-13 18:34:28

Kokui hiaN-che,

Lan chinchiaN ai:

Hanji banbana chhoe, chhoe lai ka chhim, ka khoah lan e Taioanoe, mthang chhinchhai sia Hanji, tahboe lang na philo chengsin bai e si, kalan khoaN oaikhi, liahchoekong lan si chitge cholang chosu suipian e lang, koh khah iaukin na ka lan khoaNcho si phaisimkoaN hittangchun si iaukhah chiahlat.

Romaji ahsi kong POJ tioh ai koaNkin, kho lan kaki toatoa lai sak. Tah si chiaN-pou.

120tangcheng kanna kauhoe e lang tah oehiau POJ. Chitma goa chitge msi kauhoe e lang oetang tiamchia eng POJ kap takke kong cheng/chiaN-su. Chitkhoan susit kambo khesi? Si kheh-khiam sak hoi phouphian e koanhe lah. Goa kap lausu oh Romaji 2-3tiamcheng koe, toh chaiiaN kaki mbian kho patlang anchoaN chusiu liansip, lai kianajit oetang tiamchia thak takke e Romaji chokphin. Sehhoanthau eng tengkoan e le7 lai khoaN lan e kauiok hethong, lan e siohakseng e Taigu kauchai … tengteng, si anchoaN Hoagu ka3 hakseng si sian ka kah ㄅㄆㄇ long oehiau liauau chiah ka Hanji, uisiaNmih lan e Taigu toh mbian anne ka? kiam kanna 師之惰 nia? Lan iaukoh m kakchhiN? Chengtijinbut, chenghu koaNgoan … , si khoputchu--e. Kong sak punthou gigian chiahniha choe tang ah, lan si thauke lan lai giamsiu chit e ho--bo? ChhiaN hakseng gina eng in ohtioh e hoim huho sia nngjia Taioanoe lai phiNphange. Romaji jibo ai oh chiahniha choe tang? Ti 1950-ni i-au na ai oh hia ku hakseng toh long bo khachhng thang che7 i2 loh. Hitge lausu kah hautiuN kam iau u thaulou? 瞞天過海，欺世盜名莫此為甚！ Mai sak Taigu, Taigu oe bo-khi. Sak hoi oaikhi, hoi bo lan e lenghun, sak hoi boteksek, bokhupiat, chiongkuibe ma oe khi holang kaki e siu7 kai3 ho2 kauiok uchuichun e kiaNsun khoaNmchiuNbak lai hongkhi, lai bokhi. Na anne, lan chitma si teh chhong siaN?

Khokaki khah sitchai. Romaji ahsi kong POJ si lan hitki chhang3 chhai2-koan3 e pun/pin-taN. Naboh hou lane kiaNsun u Taioanoe thang kong. Takhang long oe tang pang kanna chithang "POJ" choattui boetang pang. SiaNmih liiu long mai thiaN! Kai-bo ma ai khoaN TL e piauhian tah koh kong. HuiNtit kausi na su-iau lan boh ti POJ kaichoe TL choattui mbian eng goachoe sikan. Na chit ma be-cheng-be lai pang3-tiau7 POJ, lan chhiongkuibe oe siangthau bo chit8-ngauh. Hitchun tah lai hoah-hiu toh boe hu loh. Goa ti Kauiokpou kongpo sinhongan e si, u ti chia kong koe boh toe kongoe tuisiong lai eng TL ahsi POJ. Mkoh goa boe-a jusiuN jumtioh, goa toh hongkhi hit chiong siuNhoat loh. (Ti Taioan siukoe kauiok e khah uhoe e lang engkai long thiaNkoe Kokbintong e chongli Sun-bun siansiN ti Sambinchugi kongkoe e hitki puntaN chiahtioh?)

Chhoa Kimeng

Re: Re: ThiN-kha-e e lang kong2 thiN-kha-e e taichi.

From:
Date: 2008-06-14 00:38:18

無傳統 POJ 進前 kám 就「無台語文」--ê？學謙老師有特別講著歌仔冊 ê 文學--oh，i 講著有 1 位 sianpai 真 o-ló 歌仔冊，因為 he 有「造反」ê 精神。若是照「無傳統 POJ」就無「pin-taⁿ」就無台語 ê 理路來想，歌仔冊 ê 內容根本 bē-īng 得算是台語--ah XD

若是歌仔冊用--ê 是台語文，按呢咱 thang 知：m̄ 管是 toh-tsi̍t 種文字系統，lóng kan-taⁿ 是「語言」本身 ê 載體（vehicle），載體 ê 本身當然有好有 bái，suî-ê mā 有 suî-ê ê 優點 kap 欠點，m̄-koh 若 beh 木虱食客，講「無某 tsi̍t 種載體」，就無 hit-ê 語言，恐驚 á 按呢講就 tsiaⁿ 怪奇--ah。

Kimêng 兄 kám 有讀過 1900 tsìn 前 ê《台灣教會公報》，hām koh khah 早期 ê 白話字文獻，若有，應該真知影傳統 POJ 本身 mā 是有經過歷史的 ê 演變--ê，若是木虱食客，講無牛犂就無土地，按呢 tsit 聲有影真 oh pué-huē--a，因為歷史上 pin-taⁿ (傳統POJ) 變化 ê 款式 tsiah-ni̍h 濟，咱 m̄ 知影 toh-tsi̍t-ê 款式，tsiah 是 hit 支無 i 台語 ē 死 ê 正港天霸王 pin-taⁿ。

請開示～

On 6月13日, 下午6時34分, "gugarn.giatou" wrote:

Kokui hiaN-che,

Lan chinchiaN ai: Hanji banbana chhoe, chhoe lai ka chhim, ka khoah lan e Taioanoe, mthang chhinchhai sia Hanji, tahboe lang na philo chengsin bai e si, kalan khoaN oaikhi, liahchoekong lan si chitge cholang chosu suipian e lang, koh khah iaukin na ka lan khoaNcho si phaisimkoaN hittangchun si iaukhah chiahlat. Romaji ahsi kong POJ tioh ai koaNkin, kho lan kaki toatoa lai sak. Tah si chiaN-pou.

120tangcheng kanna kauhoe e lang tah oehiau POJ. Chitma goa chitge msi kauhoe e lang oetang tiamchia eng POJ kap takke kong cheng/chiaN-su. Chitkhoan susit kambo khesi? Si kheh-khiam sak hoi phouphian e koanhe lah. Goa kap lausu oh Romaji 2-3tiamcheng koe, toh chaiiaN kaki mbian kho patlang anchoaN chusiu liansip, lai kianajit oetang tiamchia thak takke e Romaji chokphin. Sehhoanthau eng tengkoan e le7 lai khoaN lan e kauiok hethong, lan e siohakseng e Taigu kauchai … tengteng, si anchoaN Hoagu ka3 hakseng si sian ka kah ㄅㄆㄇ long oehiau liauau chiah ka Hanji, uisiaNmih lan e Taigu toh mbian anne ka? kiam kanna 師之惰 nia? Lan iaukoh m kakchhiN? Chengtijinbut, chenghu koaNgoan … , si khoputchu--e. Kong sak punthou gigian chiahniha choe tang ah, lan si thauke lan lai giamsiu chit e ho--bo? ChhiaN hakseng gina eng in ohtioh e hoim huho sia nngjia Taioanoe lai phiNphange. Romaji jibo ai oh chiahniha choe tang? Ti 1950-ni i-au na ai oh hia ku hakseng toh long bo khachhng thang che7 i2 loh. Hitge lausu kah hautiuN kam iau u thaulou? 瞞天過海，欺世盜名莫此為甚！ Mai sak Taigu, Taigu oe bo-khi. Sak hoi oaikhi, hoi bo lan e lenghun, sak hoi boteksek, bokhupiat, chiongkuibe ma oe khi holang kaki e siu7 kai3 ho2 kauiok uchuichun e kiaNsun khoaNmchiuNbak lai hongkhi, lai bokhi. Na anne, lan chitma si teh chhong siaN?

Khokaki khah sitchai. Romaji ahsi kong POJ si lan hitki chhang3 chhai2-koan3 e pun/pin-taN. Naboh hou lane kiaNsun u Taioanoe thang kong. Takhang long oe tang pang kanna chithang "POJ" choattui boetang pang. SiaNmih liiu long mai thiaN! Kai-bo ma ai khoaN TL e piauhian tah koh kong. HuiNtit kausi na su-iau lan boh ti POJ kaichoe TL choattui mbian eng goachoe sikan. Na chit ma be-cheng-be lai pang3-tiau7 POJ, lan chhiongkuibe oe siangthau bo chit8-ngauh. Hitchun tah lai hoah-hiu toh boe hu loh. Goa ti Kauiokpou kongpo sinhongan e si, u ti chia kong koe boh toe kongoe tuisiong lai eng TL ahsi POJ. Mkoh goa boe-a jusiuN jumtioh, goa toh hongkhi hit chiong siuNhoat loh. (Ti Taioan siukoe kauiok e khah uhoe e lang engkai long thiaNkoe Kokbintong e chongli Sun-bun siansiN ti Sambinchugi kongkoe e hitki puntaN chiahtioh?)

Chhoa Kimeng

Re: Re: [tgb] Re: ThiN-kha-e e lang kong2 thiN-kha-e e taichi.

From: Kei TADA
Date: 2008-06-14 01:43:00

Goa chin chan-seng ti hak-hau kau-iok chhui-sak TL. Sou-i, chin bo ai khoaN tioh kho-pun iong TY. M-ku, che si the-che e tai-chi. The-che pun-sin na bo hit-e lek-liong, an-ne tioh chun-tu-soah. Bin-kan e un-tong eng-kai si li-eng bin-kan thoan-thong e chu-goan: POJ khah tioh.2. Voyu hiaN teh kong e na-chhiuN si teh piau-beng: TL siuN beh cheng-chhu POJ "kai-liong-pan" e te-ui. Goa jin-ui TL si tau-cheng teng-bin put-tek-i koh su-iau e tho-hiap. Sou-i long bo siuN kong su-iau hong-khi POJ. Toa-lang iong POJ, gin-a iong TL, TLPA e lang iong TLPA tioh ho. Chhui-sak TG e khun-lan chu-iau si Taioan e si-toa-lang ka-ki bo tiong-si ka-ki e gi-gian, siuN-kong iong Tiong-bun tui gin-a khah iu-li. Tioh an-ne khi phoe-hap "gin-a" (si si-toa-lang bak-chiu lai-te e gin-a). Bok-chian e kiat-ko lai khoaN che si sit-pai e le. Sou-i, lan na "ui-tioh gin-a hi-seng ka-ki e bun-hoa", lan bo ng-bang. TL si Tiong-hoa bin-kok the-che ap-pek POJ, Taioan lang "be kiau soaN" liau, u-sim e Tailan lang put-tek-i siuN chin pan-hoat e san-but. Che si kap soan-ki kang-khoan. Hau-soan-jin e lip-tiuN bo it-teng kap lan e lip-tiuN kang-khoan. Chong-si, lan ti soan-ki hit-kang tau hou "khah ho" e hau-soan-jin. M-ku be-sai bo ka-ki e lip-tiuN. Bo su-iau hi-seng ka-ki lai long phoe-hap hau-soan-jin.TADA2008/6/14 :

無傳統 POJ 進前 kám 就「無台語文」--ê？學謙老師有特別講著歌仔冊 ê 文學--oh，i 講著有 1 位 sianpai 真 o-ló 歌仔冊，因為 he 有「造反」ê 精神。若是照「無傳統 POJ」就無「pin-taⁿ」就無台語 ê 理路來想，歌仔冊 ê 內容根本 bē-īng 得算是台語--ah XD

若是歌仔冊用--ê 是台語文，按呢咱 thang 知：m̄ 管是 toh-tsi̍t 種文字系統，lóng kan-taⁿ 是「語言」本身 ê 載體（vehicle），載體 ê 本身當然有好有 bái，suî-ê mā 有 suî-ê ê 優點 kap 欠點，m̄-koh 若 beh 木虱食客，講「無某 tsi̍t 種載體」，就無 hit-ê 語言，恐驚 á 按呢講就 tsiaⁿ 怪奇--ah。

Kimêng 兄 kám 有讀過 1900 tsìn 前 ê《台灣教會公報》，hām koh khah 早期 ê 白話字文獻，若有，應該真知影傳統 POJ 本身 mā 是有經過歷史的 ê 演變--ê，若是木虱食客，講無牛犂就無土地，按呢 tsit 聲有影真 oh pué-huē--a，因為歷史上 pin-taⁿ (傳統POJ) 變化 ê 款式 tsiah-ni̍h 濟，咱 m̄ 知影 toh-tsi̍t-ê 款式，tsiah 是 hit 支無 i 台語 ē 死 ê 正港天霸王 pin-taⁿ。

請開示～

On 6月13日, 下午6時34分, "gugarn.giatou" wrote:

Kokui hiaN-che,

Lan chinchiaN ai: Hanji banbana chhoe, chhoe lai ka chhim, ka khoah lan e Taioanoe, mthang chhinchhai sia Hanji, tahboe lang na philo chengsin bai e si, kalan khoaN oaikhi, liahchoekong lan si chitge cholang chosu suipian e lang, koh khah iaukin na ka lan khoaNcho si phaisimkoaN hittangchun si iaukhah chiahlat. Romaji ahsi kong POJ tioh ai koaNkin, kho lan kaki toatoa lai sak. Tah si chiaN-pou.

120tangcheng kanna kauhoe e lang tah oehiau POJ. Chitma goa chitge msi kauhoe e lang oetang tiamchia eng POJ kap takke kong cheng/chiaN-su. Chitkhoan susit kambo khesi? Si kheh-khiam sak hoi phouphian e koanhe lah. Goa kap lausu oh Romaji 2-3tiamcheng koe, toh chaiiaN kaki mbian kho patlang anchoaN chusiu liansip, lai kianajit oetang tiamchia thak takke e Romaji chokphin. Sehhoanthau eng tengkoan e le7 lai khoaN lan e kauiok hethong, lan e siohakseng e Taigu kauchai … tengteng, si anchoaN Hoagu ka3 hakseng si sian ka kah ㄅㄆㄇ long oehiau liauau chiah ka Hanji, uisiaNmih lan e Taigu toh mbian anne ka? kiam kanna 師之惰 nia? Lan iaukoh m kakchhiN? Chengtijinbut, chenghu koaNgoan … , si khoputchu--e. Kong sak punthou gigian chiahniha choe tang ah, lan si thauke lan lai giamsiu chit e ho--bo? ChhiaN hakseng gina eng in ohtioh e hoim huho sia nngjia Taioanoe lai phiNphange. Romaji jibo ai oh chiahniha choe tang? Ti 1950-ni i-au na ai oh hia ku hakseng toh long bo khachhng thang che7 i2 loh. Hitge lausu kah hautiuN kam iau u thaulou? 瞞天過海，欺世盜名莫此為甚！ Mai sak Taigu, Taigu oe bo-khi. Sak hoi oaikhi, hoi bo lan e lenghun, sak hoi boteksek, bokhupiat, chiongkuibe ma oe khi holang kaki e siu7 kai3 ho2 kauiok uchuichun e kiaNsun khoaNmchiuNbak lai hongkhi, lai bokhi. Na anne, lan chitma si teh chhong siaN?

Khokaki khah sitchai. Romaji ahsi kong POJ si lan hitki chhang3 chhai2-koan3 e pun/pin-taN. Naboh hou lane kiaNsun u Taioanoe thang kong. Takhang long oe tang pang kanna chithang "POJ" choattui boetang pang. SiaNmih liiu long mai thiaN! Kai-bo ma ai khoaN TL e piauhian tah koh kong. HuiNtit kausi na su-iau lan boh ti POJ kaichoe TL choattui mbian eng goachoe sikan. Na chit ma be-cheng-be lai pang3-tiau7 POJ, lan chhiongkuibe oe siangthau bo chit8-ngauh. Hitchun tah lai hoah-hiu toh boe hu loh. Goa ti Kauiokpou kongpo sinhongan e si, u ti chia kong koe boh toe kongoe tuisiong lai eng TL ahsi POJ. Mkoh goa boe-a jusiuN jumtioh, goa toh hongkhi hit chiong siuNhoat loh. (Ti Taioan siukoe kauiok e khah uhoe e lang engkai long thiaNkoe Kokbintong e chongli Sun-bun siansiN ti Sambinchugi kongkoe e hitki puntaN chiahtioh?)

Chhoa Kimeng

Re: Re: [tgb] Re: ThiN-kha-e e lang kong2 thiN-kha-e e taichi.

From: Tekhoa
Date: 2008-06-14 19:30:52

goa chin tong-i Hakkhiam kap Ta-da-sang kong--e bo engkai toe ROC heng-cheng the-he kiaNtiong-iau--e si lan taute beh chhong siaN chhui-sak Tai-gi-bun untong e bok-tek taute si siaN?Tekhoa

----- Original Message ----- From: "Kei TADA" To: Cc: "Tai-gu-bang" Sent: Saturday, June 14, 2008 1:43 AM Subject: [tgb] Re: ThiN-kha-e e lang kong2 thiN-kha-e e taichi.

Goa chin chan-seng ti hak-hau kau-iok chhui-sak TL. Sou-i, chin bo ai khoaN tioh kho-pun iong TY.

M-ku, che si the-che e tai-chi. The-che pun-sin na bo hit-e lek-liong, an-ne tioh chun-tu-soah. Bin-kan e un-tong eng-kai si li-eng bin-kan thoan-thong e chu-goan: POJ khah tioh.

Voyu hiaN teh kong e na-chhiuN si teh piau-beng: TL siuN beh cheng-chhu POJ "kai-liong-pan" e te-ui.

Goa jin-ui TL si tau-cheng teng-bin put-tek-i koh su-iau e tho-hiap. Sou-i long bo siuN kong su-iau hong-khi POJ. Toa-lang iong POJ, gin-a iong TL, TLPA e lang iong TLPA tioh ho.

Chhui-sak TG e khun-lan chu-iau si Taioan e si-toa-lang ka-ki bo tiong-si ka-ki e gi-gian, siuN-kong iong Tiong-bun tui gin-a khah iu-li. Tioh an-ne khi phoe-hap "gin-a" (si si-toa-lang bak-chiu lai-te e gin-a). Bok-chian e kiat-ko lai khoaN che si sit-pai e le. Sou-i, lan na "ui-tioh gin-a hi-seng ka-ki e bun-hoa", lan bo ng-bang.

TL si Tiong-hoa bin-kok the-che ap-pek POJ, Taioan lang "be kiau soaN" liau, u-sim e Tailan lang put-tek-i siuN chin pan-hoat e san-but. Che si kap soan-ki kang-khoan. Hau-soan-jin e lip-tiuN bo it-teng kap lan e lip-tiuN kang-khoan. Chong-si, lan ti soan-ki hit-kang tau hou "khah ho" e hau-soan-jin. M-ku be-sai bo ka-ki e lip-tiuN. Bo su-iau hi-seng ka-ki lai long phoe-hap hau-soan-jin.

TADA

2008/6/14 :

無傳統 POJ 進前 kám 就「無台語文」--ê？學謙老師有特別講著歌仔冊 ê 文學--oh，i 講著有 1 位 sianpai 真 o-ló 歌仔冊，因為 he 有「造反」ê 精神。若是照「無傳統 POJ」就無「pin-taⁿ」就無台語 ê 理路來想，歌仔冊 ê 內容根本 bē-īng 得算是台語--ah XD

若是歌仔冊用--ê 是台語文，按呢咱 thang 知：m̄ 管是 toh-tsi̍t 種文字系統，lóng kan-taⁿ 是「語言」本身 ê 載體（vehicle），載體 ê 本身當然有好有 bái，suî-ê mā 有 suî-ê ê 優點 kap 欠點，m̄-koh 若 beh 木虱食客，講「無某 tsi̍t 種載體」，就無 hit-ê 語言，恐驚 á 按呢講就 tsiaⁿ 怪奇--ah。

Kimêng 兄 kám 有讀過 1900 tsìn 前 ê《台灣教會公報》，hām koh khah 早期 ê 白話字文獻，若有，應該真知影傳統 POJ 本身 mā 是有經過歷史的 ê 演變--ê，若是木虱食客，講無牛犂就無土地，按呢 tsit 聲有影真 oh pué-huē--a，因為歷史上 pin-taⁿ (傳統POJ) 變化 ê 款式 tsiah-ni̍h 濟，咱 m̄ 知影 toh-tsi̍t-ê 款式，tsiah 是 hit 支無 i 台語 ē 死 ê 正港天霸王 pin-taⁿ。

請開示～

On 6月13日, 下午6時34分, "gugarn.giatou" wrote:

Kokui hiaN-che,

Lan chinchiaN ai: Hanji banbana chhoe, chhoe lai ka chhim, ka khoah lan e Taioanoe, mthang chhinchhai sia Hanji, tahboe lang na philo chengsin bai e si, kalan khoaN oaikhi, liahchoekong lan si chitge cholang chosu suipian e lang, koh khah iaukin na ka lan khoaNcho si phaisimkoaN hittangchun si iaukhah chiahlat. Romaji ahsi kong POJ tioh ai koaNkin, kho lan kaki toatoa lai sak. Tah si chiaN-pou.

120tangcheng kanna kauhoe e lang tah oehiau POJ. Chitma goa chitge msi kauhoe e lang oetang tiamchia eng POJ kap takke kong cheng/chiaN-su. Chitkhoan susit kambo khesi? Si kheh-khiam sak hoi phouphian e koanhe lah. Goa kap lausu oh Romaji 2-3tiamcheng koe, toh chaiiaN kaki mbian kho patlang anchoaN chusiu liansip, lai kianajit oetang tiamchia thak takke e Romaji chokphin. Sehhoanthau eng tengkoan e le7 lai khoaN lan e kauiok hethong, lan e siohakseng e Taigu kauchai … tengteng, si anchoaN Hoagu ka3 hakseng si sian ka kah ㄅㄆㄇ long oehiau liauau chiah ka Hanji, uisiaNmih lan e Taigu toh mbian anne ka? kiam kanna 師之惰 nia? Lan iaukoh m kakchhiN? Chengtijinbut, chenghu koaNgoan … , si khoputchu--e. Kong sak punthou gigian chiahniha choe tang ah, lan si thauke lan lai giamsiu chit e ho--bo? ChhiaN hakseng gina eng in ohtioh e hoim huho sia nngjia Taioanoe lai phiNphange. Romaji jibo ai oh chiahniha choe tang? Ti 1950-ni i-au na ai oh hia ku hakseng toh long bo khachhng thang che7 i2 loh. Hitge lausu kah hautiuN kam iau u thaulou? 瞞天過海，欺世盜名莫此為甚！ Mai sak Taigu, Taigu oe bo-khi. Sak hoi oaikhi, hoi bo lan e lenghun, sak hoi boteksek, bokhupiat, chiongkuibe ma oe khi holang kaki e siu7 kai3 ho2 kauiok uchuichun e kiaNsun khoaNmchiuNbak lai hongkhi, lai bokhi. Na anne, lan chitma si teh chhong siaN?

Khokaki khah sitchai. Romaji ahsi kong POJ si lan hitki chhang3 chhai2-koan3 e pun/pin-taN. Naboh hou lane kiaNsun u Taioanoe thang kong. Takhang long oe tang pang kanna chithang "POJ" choattui boetang pang. SiaNmih liiu long mai thiaN! Kai-bo ma ai khoaN TL e piauhian tah koh kong. HuiNtit kausi na su-iau lan boh ti POJ kaichoe TL choattui mbian eng goachoe sikan. Na chit ma be-cheng-be lai pang3-tiau7 POJ, lan chhiongkuibe oe siangthau bo chit8-ngauh. Hitchun tah lai hoah-hiu toh boe hu loh. Goa ti Kauiokpou kongpo sinhongan e si, u ti chia kong koe boh toe kongoe tuisiong lai eng TL ahsi POJ. Mkoh goa boe-a jusiuN jumtioh, goa toh hongkhi hit chiong siuNhoat loh. (Ti Taioan siukoe kauiok e khah uhoe e lang engkai long thiaNkoe Kokbintong e chongli Sun-bun siansiN ti Sambinchugi kongkoe e hitki puntaN chiahtioh?)

Chhoa Kimeng

Re: [tgb] Re: ThiN-kha-e e lang kong2 thiN-kha-e e taichi.

From: Lau Seng-hian
Date: 2008-06-15 00:18:08

Tsit-kiann tai-tsi gua si an-ne khuann--e.

Lan tshui-sak Tai-gi-bun e bok-piau ping bo pian (tsing-tsha ti lan sui-lang e bok-piau huan-se bo uan-tsuan sio-siang)

Si lan teh tsing-tshu the-tse e tsu-guan, khuann

in beh ua kue-lai kiann ng kang-tsit-e bok-piau--bo , khah m-si lan khi phue-hap--in, khi hi-sing lan e bok-piau.

Uann 1 ku ue lai kong, lan iu-guan tit-tit teh ng lan e bok-piau kiann ng tsing, na u lang ma beh ng hit-e

bok-piau kiann--e, m-kuan i si the-tse lai iah-si the-tse gua, lan long ka tsoo-tsan, na bo beh tsi-tshi tsit-e bok- piau--e, lan to tui-khong.

Tui tsit-e kak-too lai khuann, to si Kada san kong--e hio-suan-jin e to-li, gua kam-kak ping bo siann bo-kang.

2008/6/14 Tekhoa :

goa chin tong-i Hakkhiam kap Ta-da-sang kong--e

bo engkai toe ROC heng-cheng the-he kiaN

tiong-iau--e si lan taute beh chhong siaN

chhui-sak Tai-gi-bun untong e bok-tek taute si siaN?

Tekhoa

----- Original Message -----

From: "Kei TADA"

To:

Cc: "Tai-gu-bang"

Sent: Saturday, June 14, 2008 1:43 AM

Subject: [tgb] Re: ThiN-kha-e e lang kong2 thiN-kha-e e taichi.

Goa chin chan-seng ti hak-hau kau-iok chhui-sak TL.

Sou-i, chin bo ai khoaN tioh kho-pun iong TY.

M-ku, che si the-che e tai-chi.

The-che pun-sin na bo hit-e lek-liong, an-ne tioh chun-tu-soah.

Bin-kan e un-tong eng-kai si li-eng bin-kan thoan-thong e chu-goan:

POJ khah tioh.

Voyu hiaN teh kong e na-chhiuN si teh piau-beng:

TL siuN beh cheng-chhu POJ "kai-liong-pan" e te-ui.

Goa jin-ui TL si tau-cheng teng-bin put-tek-i koh su-iau e tho-hiap.

Sou-i long bo siuN kong su-iau hong-khi POJ.

Toa-lang iong POJ, gin-a iong TL, TLPA e lang iong TLPA tioh ho.

Chhui-sak TG e khun-lan chu-iau si Taioan e si-toa-lang ka-ki

bo tiong-si ka-ki e gi-gian, siuN-kong iong Tiong-bun tui gin-a khah

iu-li.

Tioh an-ne khi phoe-hap "gin-a" (si si-toa-lang bak-chiu lai-te e

gin-a).

Bok-chian e kiat-ko lai khoaN che si sit-pai e le.

Sou-i, lan na "ui-tioh gin-a hi-seng ka-ki e bun-hoa", lan bo ng-bang.

TL si Tiong-hoa bin-kok the-che ap-pek POJ, Taioan lang "be kiau soaN"

liau,

u-sim e Tailan lang put-tek-i siuN chin pan-hoat e san-but.

Che si kap soan-ki kang-khoan.

Hau-soan-jin e lip-tiuN bo it-teng kap lan e lip-tiuN kang-khoan.

Chong-si, lan ti soan-ki hit-kang tau hou "khah ho" e hau-soan-jin.

M-ku be-sai bo ka-ki e lip-tiuN. Bo su-iau hi-seng ka-ki lai long

phoe-hap hau-soan-jin.

TADA

2008/6/14 :

無傳統 POJ 進前 kám 就「無台語文」--ê？學謙老師有特別講著

歌仔冊 ê 文學--oh，i 講著有 1 位 sianpai 真 o-ló 歌仔冊，因為

he 有「造反」ê 精神。若是照「無傳統 POJ」就無「pin-taⁿ」就

無台語 ê 理路來想，歌仔冊 ê 內容根本 bē-īng 得算是台語--ah XD

若是歌仔冊用--ê 是台語文，按呢咱 thang 知：m̄ 管是 toh-tsi̍t 種

文字系統，lóng kan-taⁿ 是「語言」本身 ê 載體（vehicle），載體

ê 本身當然有好有 bái，suî-ê mā 有 suî-ê ê 優點 kap 欠點，m̄-koh

若 beh 木虱食客，講「無某 tsi̍t 種載體」，就無 hit-ê 語言，恐驚

á 按呢講就 tsiaⁿ 怪奇--ah。

Kimêng 兄 kám 有讀過 1900 tsìn 前 ê《台灣教會公報》，hām koh

khah 早期 ê 白話字文獻，若有，應該真知影傳統 POJ 本身 mā 是有

經過歷史的 ê 演變--ê，若是木虱食客，講無牛犂就無土地，按呢 tsit

聲有影真 oh pué-huē--a，因為歷史上 pin-taⁿ (傳統POJ) 變化 ê 款式

tsiah-ni̍h 濟，咱 m̄ 知影 toh-tsi̍t-ê 款式，tsiah 是 hit 支無 i 台語 ē 死

ê 正港天霸王 pin-taⁿ。

請開示～

On 6月13日, 下午6時34分, "gugarn.giatou"

wrote:

Kokui hiaN-che,

Lan chinchiaN ai:

Hanji banbana chhoe, chhoe lai ka chhim, ka khoah lan e Taioanoe, mthang

chhinchhai sia Hanji, tahboe lang na philo chengsin bai e si, kalan

khoaN oaikhi, liahchoekong lan si chitge cholang chosu suipian e lang,

koh khah iaukin na ka lan khoaNcho si phaisimkoaN hittangchun si iaukhah

chiahlat.

Romaji ahsi kong POJ tioh ai koaNkin, kho lan kaki toatoa lai sak. Tah

si chiaN-pou.

120tangcheng kanna kauhoe e lang tah oehiau POJ. Chitma goa chitge msi

kauhoe e lang oetang tiamchia eng POJ kap takke kong cheng/chiaN-su.

Chitkhoan susit kambo khesi? Si kheh-khiam sak hoi phouphian e koanhe

lah. Goa kap lausu oh Romaji 2-3tiamcheng koe, toh chaiiaN kaki mbian

kho patlang anchoaN chusiu liansip, lai kianajit oetang tiamchia thak

takke e Romaji chokphin. Sehhoanthau eng tengkoan e le7 lai khoaN lan e

kauiok hethong, lan e siohakseng e Taigu kauchai … tengteng, si

anchoaN Hoagu ka3 hakseng si sian ka kah ㄅㄆㄇ long oehiau liauau chiah

ka Hanji, uisiaNmih lan e Taigu toh mbian anne ka? kiam kanna 師之惰

nia? Lan iaukoh m kakchhiN? Chengtijinbut, chenghu koaNgoan … , si

khoputchu--e. Kong sak punthou gigian chiahniha choe tang ah, lan si

thauke lan lai giamsiu chit e ho--bo? ChhiaN hakseng gina eng in ohtioh

e hoim huho sia nngjia Taioanoe lai phiNphange. Romaji jibo ai oh

chiahniha choe tang? Ti 1950-ni i-au na ai oh hia ku hakseng toh long

bo khachhng thang che7 i2 loh. Hitge lausu kah hautiuN kam iau u

thaulou? 瞞天過海，欺世盜名莫此為甚！ Mai sak Taigu, Taigu oe bo-khi.

Sak hoi oaikhi, hoi bo lan e lenghun, sak hoi boteksek, bokhupiat,

chiongkuibe ma oe khi holang kaki e siu7 kai3 ho2 kauiok uchuichun e

kiaNsun khoaNmchiuNbak lai hongkhi, lai bokhi. Na anne, lan chitma si

teh chhong siaN?

Khokaki khah sitchai. Romaji ahsi kong POJ si lan hitki chhang3

chhai2-koan3 e pun/pin-taN. Naboh hou lane kiaNsun u Taioanoe thang

kong. Takhang long oe tang pang kanna chithang "POJ" choattui boetang

pang. SiaNmih liiu long mai thiaN! Kai-bo ma ai khoaN TL e piauhian

tah koh kong. HuiNtit kausi na su-iau lan boh ti POJ kaichoe TL

choattui mbian eng goachoe sikan. Na chit ma be-cheng-be lai

pang3-tiau7 POJ, lan chhiongkuibe oe siangthau bo chit8-ngauh. Hitchun

tah lai hoah-hiu toh boe hu loh. Goa ti Kauiokpou kongpo sinhongan e

si, u ti chia kong koe boh toe kongoe tuisiong lai eng TL ahsi POJ.

Mkoh goa boe-a jusiuN jumtioh, goa toh hongkhi hit chiong siuNhoat loh.

(Ti Taioan siukoe kauiok e khah uhoe e lang engkai long thiaNkoe

Kokbintong e chongli Sun-bun siansiN ti Sambinchugi kongkoe e hitki

puntaN chiahtioh?)

Chhoa Kimeng

-- Lau, Seng-hian

～無 koh 在定，ma 無放外外～

Re: Re: [tgb] ThiN-kha-e e lang kong2 thiN-kha-e e taichi.

From: gugarn.giatou
Date: 2008-06-17 14:19:04

TaN tangtaN e lang, engkai boe koan puntaN e iu5-lai5, i oe khah ti-i tuitiong hitki puntaN simsi ho-eng, taN ku simsi oe kho3 kanthau. I oe ti hit puntaN koutiautiau, hiam khi piansou to chahkinkin, inui siokang hiachoe khangkhe nabo hitki puntaN kaieng phang5--e, i oe ke phang chiokchoe choa7, ke hioh chiokchoe khun3, cho longbo khangkhe.

Gigian kah bunji siangsi chu2? siangsi kheh?

Chiu Taibun laikong, Romaji chhaputto chiuNsoaN lohhai long bo buntoe loh. Hanji iaukoh ti chuitiong teh bok8-bok8-siu5. Soui goa chutiuN, bat POJ e lang ai gim houi tiau, peh khui bakchiu kimkimkhoaN TL si u teh sak--bo? si anchoaN sakhoat? sak ti touikhi? sak chhut siaNmih sengko?(lang long kong lan si thauke, lan oesai oh cho khoaNmaie boe?) Lan chima na POJ Koh khah toatoa lai sak, tan TL cho kau bou chitge khamcham tah lai toe, huiNtit engkai kausi tah lai kai pengbo khunlan.

Soalohlai tui Hanji goa iugoan jinui banbanchhoe, chhoe chhut im-i longbo chengchip, im-i long itti e ji. Goa siongtamsim e si, lan tengchit-un kah lan chit-un e lang long si2 oan5, lan e kiaNsun kiam iauu Taioanoe thang kong? Kiam iauboh kong Taioanoe? Lan chitma na Hanji lau hou Tiongbun, lan Taioanoe choankong Romaji, housiong boe sio kanjiau kam m ho? Lan tah tittioh hittiam-a kongkiong chugoan nia(Kouputjichiong englai ka3 takke oh oehiau su-iong Romaji tiohho, engkai u kau loh.), Tiongbunlang teh kiaN lan siaN?

Tiongbun e ji e im-i ti lan takke e simtiong long tengheng loh. Kiatko ma iaukoh chiok khi7 火星文 . Lan Taibun ti lan Taioan siahoe takhang long iau bo-pat-e haiN--e. Simsi ai pi Tiongbun koh khah giamkeh chiahtioh? Kouputjichiong uitioh boh sak giapbu lai biankiong eng bou kuiji u chengchip e Hanji, uitioh kong1 kah li7, lan boe tong3 lang chailou, mkoh na ut/oat-thau kong hia ji si tioh--e, he toh chha loh. Susitsiong houim huho msi ka3 kui-a-tang loh, bochuichun e ji laikaieng li kah-i e houim huho kam m ho, na thang eng anne lai loan? Chuntiong lan kaki e gigian, chuntiong lang e gigian e iaukiu kam bo chengkhakseng? Iaukiu takke sia houim huho tui chhuisak Taioanoe oe u pangchan--bo?

Chhoa Kimeng

----- Original Message -----

From: Lau Seng-hian

To: 台語網

Sent: Sunday, June 15, 2008 12:18 AM

Subject: [tgb] ThiN-kha-e e lang kong2 thiN-kha-e e taichi.

Tsit-kiann tai-tsi gua si an-ne khuann--e.

Lan tshui-sak Tai-gi-bun e bok-piau ping bo pian (tsing-tsha ti lan sui-lang e bok-piau huan-se bo uan-tsuan sio-siang)

Si lan teh tsing-tshu the-tse e tsu-guan, khuann in beh ua kue-lai kiann ng kang-tsit-e bok-piau--bo , khah m-si lan khi phue-hap--in, khi hi-sing lan e bok-piau.

Uann 1 ku ue lai kong, lan iu-guan tit-tit teh ng lan e bok-piau kiann ng tsing, na u lang ma beh ng hit-e bok-piau kiann--e, m-kuan i si the-tse lai iah-si the-tse gua, lan long ka tsoo-tsan, na bo beh tsi-tshi tsit-e bok- piau--e, lan to tui-khong.

Tui tsit-e kak-too lai khuann, to si Kada san kong--e hio-suan-jin e to-li, gua kam-kak ping bo siann bo-kang.

2008/6/14 Tekhoa :

goa chin tong-i Hakkhiam kap Ta-da-sang kong--e bo engkai toe ROC heng-cheng the-he kiaN

tiong-iau--e si lan taute beh chhong siaN chhui-sak Tai-gi-bun untong e bok-tek taute si siaN?

Tekhoa

Original Message ----- From: "Kei TADA"  To:  Cc: 
"Tai-gu-bang"  Sent: 
Saturday, June 14, 2008 1:43 AM Subject: [tgb] Re: ThiN-kha-e e lang 
kong2 thiN-kha-e e taichi.

Goa chin chan-seng ti hak-hau kau-iok chhui-sak TL. Sou-i, chin bo ai khoaN tioh kho-pun iong TY.

M-ku, che si the-che e tai-chi.

  The-che pun-sin na bo hit-e lek-liong, an-ne tioh 
chun-tu-soah.   Bin-kan e un-tong eng-kai si li-eng bin-kan 
thoan-thong e chu-goan: POJ khah tioh.

Voyu hiaN teh kong e na-chhiuN si teh piau-beng: TL siuN beh cheng-chhu POJ "kai-liong-pan" e te-ui.

Goa jin-ui TL si tau-cheng teng-bin put-tek-i koh su-iau e tho-hiap. Sou-i long bo siuN kong su-iau hong-khi POJ. Toa-lang iong POJ, gin-a iong TL, TLPA e lang iong TLPA tioh ho.

Chhui-sak TG e khun-lan chu-iau si Taioan e si-toa-lang ka-ki bo tiong-si ka-ki e gi-gian, siuN-kong iong Tiong-bun tui gin-a khah

iu-li.   Tioh an-ne khi phoe-hap "gin-a" (si si-toa-lang 
bak-chiu lai-te e gin-a).   Bok-chian e kiat-ko lai 
khoaN che si sit-pai e le.   Sou-i, lan na "ui-tioh gin-a 
hi-seng ka-ki e bun-hoa", lan bo ng-bang.

TL si Tiong-hoa bin-kok the-che ap-pek POJ, Taioan lang "be kiau soaN"

liau,   u-sim e Tailan lang put-tek-i siuN chin pan-hoat e 
san-but.   Che si kap soan-ki kang-khoan.   
Hau-soan-jin e lip-tiuN bo it-teng kap lan e lip-tiuN kang-khoan.

  Chong-si, lan ti soan-ki hit-kang tau hou "khah ho" e 
hau-soan-jin.   M-ku be-sai bo ka-ki e lip-tiuN. Bo su-iau 
hi-seng ka-ki lai long phoe-hap hau-soan-jin.


TADA

2008/6/14 :

無傳統 POJ 進前 kám 就「無台語文」--ê？學謙老師有特別講著歌仔冊 ê 文學--oh，i 講著有 1 位 sianpai 真 o-ló 歌仔冊，因為 he 有「造反」ê 精神。若是照「無傳統 POJ」就無「pin-taⁿ」就

無台語 ê 理路來想，歌仔冊 ê 內容根本 bē-īng 得算是台語--ah   XD


若是歌仔冊用--ê 是台語文，按呢咱 thang 知：m̄ 管是 toh-tsi̍t 種 文字系統，lóng kan-taⁿ 
是「語言」本身 ê 載體（vehicle），載體 ê 本身當然有好有 bái，suî-ê mā 有 suî-ê ê 優點 kap 
欠點，m̄-koh 若 beh 木虱食客，講「無某 tsi̍t 種載體」，就無 hit-ê 語言，恐驚

á 按呢講就 tsiaⁿ 怪奇--ah。

請開示～

On 6月13日, 下午6時34分, "gugarn.giatou"

wrote: > Kokui hiaN-che, > > Lan 
chinchiaN ai: > Hanji banbana chhoe, chhoe lai ka chhim, ka 
khoah lan e Taioanoe, mthang > chhinchhai sia Hanji, tahboe 
lang na philo chengsin bai e si, kalan > khoaN oaikhi, 
liahchoekong lan si chitge cholang chosu suipian e lang, > koh 
khah iaukin na ka lan khoaNcho si phaisimkoaN hittangchun si 
iaukhah > chiahlat. > Romaji ahsi kong POJ tioh 
ai koaNkin, kho lan kaki toatoa lai sak.  Tah > si 
chiaN-pou. > > 120tangcheng kanna kauhoe e lang 
tah oehiau POJ.  Chitma goa chitge msi > kauhoe e lang 
oetang tiamchia eng POJ kap takke kong cheng/chiaN-su. > 
Chitkhoan susit kambo khesi?  Si kheh-khiam sak hoi phouphian e 
koanhe > lah.  Goa kap lausu oh Romaji 2-3tiamcheng koe, 
toh chaiiaN kaki mbian > kho patlang anchoaN chusiu liansip, 
lai kianajit oetang tiamchia thak > takke e Romaji chokphin. 
 Sehhoanthau eng tengkoan e le7 lai khoaN lan e > kauiok 
hethong, lan e siohakseng e Taigu kauchai ... tengteng, si > 
anchoaN Hoagu ka3 hakseng si sian ka kah ㄅㄆㄇ long oehiau liauau 
chiah > ka Hanji, uisiaNmih lan e Taigu toh mbian anne ka? 
kiam kanna 師之惰 > nia?  Lan iaukoh m kakchhiN? 
 Chengtijinbut, chenghu koaNgoan ... , si > khoputchu--e. 
 Kong sak punthou gigian chiahniha choe tang ah, lan si > 
thauke lan lai giamsiu chit e ho--bo?  ChhiaN hakseng gina eng in 
ohtioh > e hoim huho sia nngjia Taioanoe lai phiNphange. 
 Romaji jibo ai oh > chiahniha choe tang?  Ti 
1950-ni i-au na ai oh hia ku hakseng toh long > bo khachhng 
thang che7 i2 loh.  Hitge lausu kah hautiuN kam iau u > 
thaulou?  瞞天過海，欺世盜名莫此為甚！  Mai sak Taigu, Taigu oe 
bo-khi. > Sak hoi oaikhi, hoi bo lan e lenghun, sak hoi 
boteksek, bokhupiat, > chiongkuibe ma oe khi holang kaki e 
siu7 kai3 ho2 kauiok uchuichun e > kiaNsun khoaNmchiuNbak lai 
hongkhi, lai bokhi.  Na anne, lan chitma si > teh chhong 
siaN? > > Khokaki khah sitchai.  Romaji 
ahsi kong POJ si lan hitki chhang3 > chhai2-koan3 e 
pun/pin-taN.  Naboh hou lane kiaNsun u Taioanoe thang > 
kong.  Takhang long oe tang pang kanna chithang "POJ" choattui 
boetang > pang.  SiaNmih liiu long mai thiaN! 
 Kai-bo ma ai khoaN TL e piauhian > tah koh kong. 
 HuiNtit kausi na su-iau lan boh ti POJ kaichoe TL > 
choattui mbian eng goachoe sikan.  Na chit ma be-cheng-be 
lai > pang3-tiau7 POJ, lan chhiongkuibe oe siangthau bo 
chit8-ngauh.  Hitchun > tah lai hoah-hiu toh boe hu loh. 
 Goa ti Kauiokpou kongpo sinhongan e > si, u ti chia kong 
koe boh toe kongoe tuisiong lai eng TL ahsi POJ. > Mkoh goa 
boe-a jusiuN jumtioh, goa toh hongkhi hit chiong siuNhoat 
loh. > (Ti Taioan siukoe kauiok e khah uhoe e lang engkai long 
thiaNkoe > Kokbintong e chongli Sun-bun siansiN ti Sambinchugi 
kongkoe e hitki > puntaN 
chiahtioh?) > > Chhoa Kimeng

>

Lau, Seng-hian

～無 koh 在定，ma 無放外外～

Re: Re: [tgb] ThiN-kha-e e lang kong2 thiN-kha-e e taichi.

From: gugarn.giatou
Date: 2008-06-18 18:59:23

Hanji mkoan tui ka3-e-lang, oh-e-lang ahsi chionglaie suiong longoe chengka chiokchoe sengpun, khuilat, sikan, chugoan … . U chitge chong-hong5 saihu in3 giap8-chu2: "Goa msi ai cho, goa si ai thanchiN." Engkai toapouhun e lang longsi ai "oe hou kaki seng2-pun2-to-li7 e su7-hang7" chiahtioh!

Lan kinajit chenghu tah pun houlan hittiama sikan kah chugoan thang lai chhuisak lane Taioanoe. Lan chin mgoan, mkoh lan masi ai posioh lan sou tittioh--e hittiama chugoan. Lan u chiahnihachoe e mihkiaN boh ka hou lan e gina, lan na m hoho-tiak, m hoho pai chitge sianhio sunsu, soalai chhinchhai ka, simsi siuNkoethau bochhai? Hanji si iauboe chiauchng koh u chiokchoe oe chengchip e ji, iau ti teh tengkiu takke isu e kaitoaN, si ai eng chiokchoe sikan chiah oetang ka3-chhut sengchiu e bunji, na anne ti chitma chitge tangchun kiam oetang thehlai ka gina? kiam engkai si iusian e soantek?

Gigian kam msi long seng ka houim? Lan hakhau e gina kam msi kanna chittiama sikan thanglai oh Taigi nia? Romaji simsi tui3-tui3? Lan na te-1-pun e kauchai kanna teh ka Romaji anchoaN jinbat, anchoaN suiong, toe3 muichitji jibo e jinbat tangtiong long sunsoa ka 7-ge siaNtiau(chhun teh ka imgak e imkai anne), u sikan, oe kipsiu koh kiam-kong2 piantiau. Anne mchai ai goaku lan takke chhinchhai toh oetang ti si3-ke3 long khoaN oetioh lane siohak gina eng Romaji sou sia e Taioanoe e "ji"? Anne tui lan Taigi e chhuisak mchai oe u "chinchiaN sitchai" e pangchan--bo? Houim huho ka oehiaue, na koh u jitian, sutian, ji5-tong5 khanbut gina toh u chusiu chinpou e kihoe. Pianchhe e gaulang, chhutpansia t.t. hoanse ahsi lipunlang tohoe toe teh titli(thanchiN). ChhitiuN simsi oetang anne lai poeiong khilai. Tngtioh 同質性 kah 可替代性 e si, khah jiokse e hit-peng oe seng to2, seng iuN5-khi3. Che tiohsi ChhitiuN.

Bong chhamkho.

Lolat.

Kiaujiau takke chinku. Phaise.

Chhoa Kimeng

----- Original Message -----

From: gugarn.giatou

To: 台語網

Sent: Tuesday, June 17, 2008 2:19 PM

Subject: Re: [tgb] ThiN-kha-e e lang kong2 thiN-kha-e e taichi.

Gigian kah bunji siangsi chu2? siangsi kheh?

Chhoa Kimeng

----- Original Message ----- 

**From:** 
Lau 
Seng-hian 

**To:** 台語網 

**Sent:** Sunday, June 15, 2008 12:18 
AM

**Subject:** [tgb] ThiN-kha-e e lang kong2 
thiN-kha-e e taichi.

Tsit-kiann tai-tsi gua si an-ne khuann--e.

Lan tshui-sak Tai-gi-bun e bok-piau ping bo pian (tsing-tsha ti lan sui-lang e bok-piau huan-se bo uan-tsuan sio-siang)

Si lan teh tsing-tshu the-tse e tsu-guan, khuann in beh ua kue-lai kiann ng kang-tsit-e bok-piau--bo , khah m-si lan khi phue-hap--in, khi hi-sing lan e bok-piau.

Tui tsit-e kak-too lai khuann, to si Kada san kong--e hio-suan-jin e to-li, gua kam-kak ping bo siann bo-kang.

2008/6/14 Tekhoa :

goa chin tong-i Hakkhiam kap Ta-da-sang kong--e bo engkai toe ROC heng-cheng the-he kiaN

tiong-iau--e si lan taute beh chhong siaN chhui-sak Tai-gi-bun untong e bok-tek taute si siaN?

Tekhoa

----- Original Message ----- From: "Kei TADA" To: Cc: "Tai-gu-bang" Sent: Saturday, June 14, 2008 1:43 AM Subject: [tgb] Re: ThiN-kha-e e lang kong2 thiN-kha-e e taichi.

Goa chin chan-seng ti hak-hau kau-iok chhui-sak TL. Sou-i, chin bo ai khoaN tioh kho-pun iong TY.

M-ku, che si the-che e tai-chi. The-che pun-sin na bo hit-e lek-liong, an-ne tioh chun-tu-soah. Bin-kan e un-tong eng-kai si li-eng bin-kan thoan-thong e chu-goan: POJ khah tioh.

Voyu hiaN teh kong e na-chhiuN si teh piau-beng: TL siuN beh cheng-chhu POJ "kai-liong-pan" e te-ui.

Goa jin-ui TL si tau-cheng teng-bin put-tek-i koh su-iau e tho-hiap. Sou-i long bo siuN kong su-iau hong-khi POJ. Toa-lang iong POJ, gin-a iong TL, TLPA e lang iong TLPA tioh ho.

Chhui-sak TG e khun-lan chu-iau si Taioan e si-toa-lang ka-ki

    bo tiong-si ka-ki e gi-gian, siuN-kong iong Tiong-bun tui gin-a 
  khah iu-li.   Tioh an-ne khi phoe-hap "gin-a" (si 
  si-toa-lang bak-chiu lai-te e gin-a).   Bok-chian e 
  kiat-ko lai khoaN che si sit-pai e le.   Sou-i, lan na 
  "ui-tioh gin-a hi-seng ka-ki e bun-hoa", lan bo ng-bang.


    TL si Tiong-hoa bin-kok the-che ap-pek POJ, Taioan lang "be kiau 
  soaN" liau,   u-sim e Tailan lang put-tek-i siuN chin 
  pan-hoat e san-but.   Che si kap soan-ki kang-khoan.

    Hau-soan-jin e lip-tiuN bo it-teng kap lan e lip-tiuN 
  kang-khoan.   Chong-si, lan ti soan-ki hit-kang tau hou "khah 
  ho" e hau-soan-jin.   M-ku be-sai bo ka-ki e lip-tiuN. Bo 
  su-iau hi-seng ka-ki lai long phoe-hap 
  hau-soan-jin.

TADA

2008/6/14 :

  無傳統 POJ 進前 kám 就「無台語文」--ê？學謙老師有特別講著 歌仔冊 ê 文學--oh，i 講著有 1 位 
  sianpai 真 o-ló 歌仔冊，因為 he 有「造反」ê 精神。若是照「無傳統 
  POJ」就無「pin-taⁿ」就 無台語 ê 理路來想，歌仔冊 ê 內容根本 bē-īng 得算是台語--ah   
  XD

  請開示～

On 6月13日, 下午6時34分, "gugarn.giatou"

  wrote: > Kokui hiaN-che, > > Lan 
  chinchiaN ai: > Hanji banbana chhoe, chhoe lai ka chhim, ka 
  khoah lan e Taioanoe, mthang > chhinchhai sia Hanji, tahboe 
  lang na philo chengsin bai e si, kalan > khoaN oaikhi, 
  liahchoekong lan si chitge cholang chosu suipian e lang, > 
  koh khah iaukin na ka lan khoaNcho si phaisimkoaN hittangchun si 
  iaukhah > chiahlat. > Romaji ahsi kong POJ 
  tioh ai koaNkin, kho lan kaki toatoa lai sak.  Tah > si 
  chiaN-pou. > > 120tangcheng kanna kauhoe e 
  lang tah oehiau POJ.  Chitma goa chitge msi > kauhoe e 
  lang oetang tiamchia eng POJ kap takke kong 
  cheng/chiaN-su. > Chitkhoan susit kambo khesi?  Si 
  kheh-khiam sak hoi phouphian e koanhe > lah.  Goa kap 
  lausu oh Romaji 2-3tiamcheng koe, toh chaiiaN kaki mbian > 
  kho patlang anchoaN chusiu liansip, lai kianajit oetang tiamchia 
  thak > takke e Romaji chokphin.  Sehhoanthau eng 
  tengkoan e le7 lai khoaN lan e > kauiok hethong, lan e 
  siohakseng e Taigu kauchai ... tengteng, si > anchoaN Hoagu 
  ka3 hakseng si sian ka kah ㄅㄆㄇ long oehiau liauau chiah > ka 
  Hanji, uisiaNmih lan e Taigu toh mbian anne ka? kiam kanna 
  師之惰 > nia?  Lan iaukoh m kakchhiN?  Chengtijinbut, 
  chenghu koaNgoan ... , si > khoputchu--e.  Kong sak 
  punthou gigian chiahniha choe tang ah, lan si > thauke lan 
  lai giamsiu chit e ho--bo?  ChhiaN hakseng gina eng in 
  ohtioh > e hoim huho sia nngjia Taioanoe lai phiNphange. 
   Romaji jibo ai oh > chiahniha choe tang?  Ti 
  1950-ni i-au na ai oh hia ku hakseng toh long > bo khachhng 
  thang che7 i2 loh.  Hitge lausu kah hautiuN kam iau u > 
  thaulou?  瞞天過海，欺世盜名莫此為甚！  Mai sak Taigu, Taigu oe 
  bo-khi. > Sak hoi oaikhi, hoi bo lan e lenghun, sak hoi 
  boteksek, bokhupiat, > chiongkuibe ma oe khi holang kaki e 
  siu7 kai3 ho2 kauiok uchuichun e > kiaNsun khoaNmchiuNbak 
  lai hongkhi, lai bokhi.  Na anne, lan chitma si > teh 
  chhong siaN? > > Khokaki khah sitchai. 
   Romaji ahsi kong POJ si lan hitki chhang3 > 
  chhai2-koan3 e pun/pin-taN.  Naboh hou lane kiaNsun u Taioanoe 
  thang > kong.  Takhang long oe tang pang kanna chithang 
  "POJ" choattui boetang > pang.  SiaNmih liiu long mai 
  thiaN!  Kai-bo ma ai khoaN TL e piauhian > tah koh 
  kong.  HuiNtit kausi na su-iau lan boh ti POJ kaichoe 
  TL > choattui mbian eng goachoe sikan.  Na chit ma 
  be-cheng-be lai > pang3-tiau7 POJ, lan chhiongkuibe oe 
  siangthau bo chit8-ngauh.  Hitchun > tah lai hoah-hiu 
  toh boe hu loh.  Goa ti Kauiokpou kongpo sinhongan e > 
  si, u ti chia kong koe boh toe kongoe tuisiong lai eng TL ahsi 
  POJ. > Mkoh goa boe-a jusiuN jumtioh, goa toh hongkhi hit 
  chiong siuNhoat loh. > (Ti Taioan siukoe kauiok e khah uhoe 
  e lang engkai long thiaNkoe > Kokbintong e chongli Sun-bun 
  siansiN ti Sambinchugi kongkoe e hitki > puntaN 
  chiahtioh?) > > Chhoa Kimeng

  >

Lau, Seng-hian

～無 koh 在定，ma 無放外外～

Re: Re: [tgb] Re: ThiN-kha-e e lang kong2 thiN-kha-e e taichi.

From: 天
Date: 2008-06-18 22:27:51

我 teh 想 lán kám 会 sái 按照日本話 ê 例來做。日本話用漢字配平仮名、片仮名。Lán 漢 lô the̍h 漢字來配 lômá 字。Che tō sī 漢 lô chit ê 槪念。M̄ koh 日語 koh 有一点真 chán，tō sī 人 teh 书寫 ê 時，in 真自由，有 tang 時 á 某 mih 語詞 beh the̍h 漢字來寫 ahsī the̍h 平仮名來寫，隨在人決定。聽講甚至普通時 chabó͘ gínná khah ài 用片仮名书寫，寫出 chabó͘ gínná ê 「気口」。我 bē 暁読日本話，che 我 lóng 聽人講 ê。

Ùi hit khoán ji̍tpún sek ê susiá hēthóng lâi khíkha，lán koh ēsái kā i khiú chi̍t'ē、tiuh chi̍t'ē chò siukái。Siōng 要緊，ēsái chèngsek pauhâm sûn lômájī ê siáhoat，mā ēsái pauhâm 漢字成份 khah chiáⁿ ê hànlô 寫法！某 mih 漢字 nā ah 未「koāⁿ 定」，無要緊，寫 lômá 字 tō 好。某 mih 語詞 nā 無漢字 thang 寫，mài 勉強，寫 lômá 字 tō 好。人 nā be giàn 寫漢字 tō mài 寫漢字，寫 lômá 字 tō 好！

Koh 有一点。Lômá 字窮実 sī 兩套符号 kap 做伙 ê：大字及細字。Lán 会 sái 按照 Au 洲 ê 傳統來使用大細字，mā 会 sái kā 拆做兩種字，了後大字及細字会 sái poaⁿ 無 kāng 角色，假 ná 日本話內底 ê 平仮名及片仮名。譬喻 lán 普通時 teh 寫 ê lômá 字会 sái 用純大字（m̄ koh 会 sái 用 khah 細蕊 ê，所謂 ê 「small caps」ahsī 「細大字」）。Ahnā beh lām 外語語詞 ê 時 chiah the̍h 細字 lômá 字來寫，寫法按照原文，m̄ 免改做 hōló 文 ê 寫法。Só͘'í 「Be̍kseko」会 sái 寫做 México（原文），mā 会 sái 寫做 MÉHIKÒ（hōló 文「音譯」ê 寫法，hoānsè ài 寫 khah 細蕊 chiah bē pháiⁿ 看），當然 mā 有真 chē 人 hoānsè khah ài 寫 Be̍kseko ahsī 墨西哥，ánne mā 据在 in 去揀，in nā 歓喜 tō 好。

日語书寫系統 nā 有一 ê khah 害 ê 特色 tō sī in 訓読音用 siuⁿ chē，pháiⁿ 学 koh gâu hoe。M̄ koh he 我 tō 無真瞭解。Ná 像 lán chit 幾年 teh 寫 ê 漢 lô，訓読字用無 kài chē，我想 ánne mā 好。

逐 ê bóng 參考。感謝！

阿天

Re: Re: [tgb] Re: ThiN-kha-e e lang kong2 thiN-kha-e e taichi.

From: Tekhoa
Date: 2008-06-18 23:37:23

Athian hiaN

li kong--e "toa-ji" kap "se-ji", kam si kong "toa-sia--e" kap "sio-sia--e"?

Tekhoa

----- Original Message -----

From: 天

To: 台語網

Sent: Wednesday, June 18, 2008 10:27 PM

Subject: [tgb] Re: ThiN-kha-e e lang kong2 thiN-kha-e e taichi.

逐 ê bóng 參考。感謝！

阿天

Re: Re: [tgb] Re: ThiN-kha-e e lang kong2 thiN-kha-e e taichi.

From: 天
Date: 2008-06-19 07:41:15

Tekhoa hiann: Tioh, he to si goa teh kong e! aThinn

2008/6/18 Tekhoa :

Athian hiaN

li kong--e "toa-ji" kap "se-ji", kam si kong "toa-sia--e" kap "sio-sia--e"?

Tekhoa